Chris: yea rotten vulgarity, just unhealthy, just sadness like whoa dude she was just oozing ugliness

Jacob: fear and worry about whats going to happen. When we started playing music she was like…

Chris: She was like I need this, this is amazing.

Jesse: Were you singing some songs you wrote or some worship songs or…

Jacob: We sang some songs we wrote, and we sang some old hymns like ‘I’ll fly away’ and it just got lighter in there.

Chris: where are those dinner roles?

Jesse: oh we still got these donuts too. So how much longer… is this your life style now or you mentioned you want to settle down a little bit.

Chris: I sorta do. Its weird for me cause this whole trip Seattle has been the final destination and now we are about to be in Seattle…

Jesse: Where did you start at?

Chris: I met up with them in Denver. Seattle was our final destination and I was real excited to get there, but I kind of don’t want to get there. Like traveling with Jake and Simon, and Marley and Halla, it is so beautiful, it was such a bright thing for me like that I dunno… I forgot what the question was.

Jesse: Do you wanna settle down… is there your lifestyle or is this like a vocation?

Jacob: Seasons. I want to say I’m open to whatever God wants. And that’s what I’m aiming for. But obviously ya know all the struggles of life and stuff interfere with Gods will. Our wills are always fighting with Gods will. But yea I mean I’d like to be traveling, that’s were my heart is

Jesse: Its almost like… you tried other trades like carpentry and stuff but this is almost like a vocation for you.

Jacob: Yea God had me stationary in Seattle for roughly four months about two months ago.  I was working a painting job, my boss was pretty cool, the work was alright, it was something I could do I wasn’t bad at it. But it was just so I could learn how to love people who were different than me; one of my weaknesses. Being in the traveling culture  I like to be surrounded by travelers. Its hard to be surrouded by your average.. I mean the body of Christ is so diverse its more than just traveling kids, its people from all walks of life. So that was important for me to learn and I really didn’t discover that’s why I was there until after I left. I was like ‘oh, I really like these people.’ So yea seasons. God has us living in seasons.  I dunno maybe He’ll have me settle down for awhile. Right now I’m going back to settle down for a couple months and take a class at my folks church.

Jesse: Oh yea, what church is that?

Jacob: Its crazy cause its totally the last church I would ever choose to go to, its a Baptist church. Its like a big ya know…

Jesse: are they pastors?

Jacob: yea one of the pastors there kind of mentors me. The class is on healing from sexual abuse, so I’m gonna go take that then hopefully hit the road again. We’ll see what God has, I know God has put it on my heart to travel so I’m sure that this isn’t the end.

Chris: No way man, we got Mexico and Minnesota, and Ireland and France. (laughter) C’mon I hear there are trains out there in Europe. I’m gone.

Jesse: have you been to Europe bro?

Chris: no the only out of county I’ve done is I’ve gotten stranded in Mexico and Montreal. That’s it.

Jesse: So being on the fringes I guess or margins of society so you have a unique perspective of the country that the average person doing their 9-5 gig doesn’t have, how would you….

Chris- seduced by the image of reality instead of embracing reality.

Jesse- yea how would you describe, you were talking earlier about the state of New York, but how would you describe the state of the country. As Americans what are our biggest needs or what.. I dunno I’m interested in your guys perspectives.

Jacob: I think passion. I think our society is geared towards climbing a social ladder its capitalism ya know, its a big competition and that tends to isolate people from each other. And I think the biggest need is for people to learn… this is going to sound totally hippy but how to love. Ya know, serious. People don’t know how to love their neighbor because we are isolated from each other, we are in competition. We have walls put up to defend ourselves against our neighbor, whether they are next store or separated by actual political borders ya know. We are so absorbed by television…

Chris: we are gullible in a sense. We are seduced. I mean you see a guy, dirty, side of the road, sign saying I need a ride. First thought in your head is he could be a murderer, killer, dada dada

Jesse: dangerous

Chris: dangerous and there is fear. You see a homeless guy on the street with a sign asking for spare change you think alcoholic, not gonna do anything, dadada. We know in our heads more ads and slogans and like ‘I’m lovin it’, like music notes from McDonald’s better than we know each other and we’re so enamored in climbing this social ladder and we’re…

Jacob: we stopped having real life experiences, we live in this fantasy world that’s created by the media, ya know. I’m speaking in generalizations, people are at different levels of socialization but ya know you go home after work you turn on the TV…

Chris: and they manufacture consent.

Jacob: they manufacture consent. That becomes peoples reality and their existence. Its just like a cyber existence ya know.

Chris: A close friend of mine was arrested, I won’t say where but it made the news. What happened and what hit the news was so amazingly different. The news made him a violent crazy, dadadada. When he was celebrating one day and got beaten up by the cops. Like another… I was in a protest, ah I’m very much an activist, I’m very much a political activist. I was born on November 7th, my birthday, it doesn’t have to do with anything else but it happens to be on election day. The Mexican agrarian revolt. Like a lot of things happen on that day oddly enough.

Jesse: ha ha ha. Its in your blood.

Chris: But I was protesting… for me I don’t believe in Columbus day. See I’m very weird on the subject. I take both sides. I like to play devil’s advocate as well. I was protesting Columbus day. I feel that it celebrates….we tried so hard in the civil rights movement to get rid of segregation and stuff like that. The civil rights movement was such a beautiful movement and now to this day we are still celebrating Columbus day, where what Columbus brought to this country was genocide and trans Atlantic slavery and imperialist and we are going in complancency every year like yea! yea! whew! lets do a parade Italian pride. I’m not against Italian pride. Go ahead and be Italian. I’m a hundred percent Irish. Go Irish. Go Hindu. Go whatever. I don’t care. But don’t celebrate murder. Why? We are trying so hard to put love into this country and this is what we do? So I was a non-violent protester right, I was preceded to have my hand broken by a police officer, escorted into a bus and all types of stuff. We were treated like animals. They fed us twice. Did not let us use the phones, nothing.

Jesse: Dang

Chris: the news said, ‘wild violent protesters hit the streets.’

Jesse: and you guys were just non-violent?

Chris: you know what we did? We sat down in a circle singing Hallelujah holding hands. That’s what we did. And we were violent crazy… the media… and its brilliant, they are awesome, they’re so smart. They can convince this by saying this and we say hey yea that makes sense, right on. What this country needs is to turn… I was going to use foul language but you know what I decided against it. Our country needs to turn the TV off. Turn it off. Unplug it. Take a baseball bat to your direct TV. Direct action not direct TV. Like there is so much more important things to life than what happened on that sitcom. Go outside and say hello on your neighbor. Give fifty cents to a homeless person. As a nomadic person myself, I dunno when I’m going to get my next cigarette, I don’t know when I’m going to get my next anything.  I got fifty cents in my pocket, somebody asks me for change, you better know that twenty five cents, half of what I have… and I’m not some business man that is climbing this ladder to get to a higher position so I can have more control over these little people to make myself feel better. The country needs to turn the TV off. The country needs to love each other. Our country needs… so much. And its really disheartening sometimes. When you realize that there is an excess of over a billion cops. And I’m not against police but if we would love each other we wouldn’t need cops. Really. We have cops for protection of property and social control. When a black officer arrests an individual who is a non-violent protester that is doing something that is almost a part of the civil rights movement then breaks their hand for no reason. What is that? Its amazing to me that you find community in the ghettos. and in the places that we are all working so hard to get rid of and get away from. That’s where you find community. I mean you find community with these… in Colorado there is these dirty anarchist that do the food not bombs every week. That hold each others hands and play music and let people stay on their couches and have home gardens to feed more people to do more. They do free bicycles and all sorts of stuff. And they don’t have the means of anything. What do they have? They have the heart to give. They have the love to give. And you can’t find that in the guy who has the forty acre farm that’s growing all this wheat just to sell the wonder bread. We need a lot. We need a whole overhaul.

Jesse: A revolution of sorts…

Chris: I sorta believe in revolution. I’ve already been through it. I won. I went to war and I won. Like yo I decided and I’m done. I’ve had my revolution. That’s all it is. If everyone decided… if you like Bush in office, you like Bush in office. If you don’t like Bush in office, there you go, you won. Okay your done that’s it. If everyone decided not to vote… what’s the point of voting between two evils? Like if you look at political history Republicans and Democrats have the same idea. They do. Come on its obvious. Ya know. If everyone just separated… Whoa all the sudden its election time, lets see who votes and no one voted. Guess what? who is the majority? A people should not be afraid of its government a government should be afraid of its people. The people are empowered. And we’re amazing and beautiful once we realize that. Just who knows what we need to do to realize that. Who knows?

Jesse: That’s good man. Good stuff. You’re very passionate about that Chris that’s cool man. One last question. Just ah, what do you guys want to be known for when its all said and done. What would you want on your epitaph?

Jacob: He was patient, He was kind. He wasn’t self seeking, he wasn’t rude. He wasn’t Jealous…

Jesse: I Corinthians 13?

Jacob: Yep, I Corinthians 13 would do it. That’s what I would like.

Jesse: sick, that’s beautiful.

Chris: I have a very odd sense of humor. I would like… so many different ideas come into my head. What would be really fun like ‘name withheld. Information withheld for national peacekeeping.’ (laughter) Or ahhh, I dunno, ‘died at sea killing giant octopus.’ (laughter) Like I don’t need an epitaph, I don’t.

Jesse: maybe not an epitaph but like those closest to you would describe you this way.  man Chris was…. this was the message he embodied.

Chris: that was one weird dude. (laughter) He said some stuff. And he smelled kind of funny. I don’t care. Let them think about it when I’m gone.  I don’t want to think about that. I’m to busy being passionate and I kind of really want these signs with thumbs up crossed out. (laughter) I want want of these no positivity signs. I want to put it in my kitchen. You can’t have a positive kitchen. Its not allowed. No positivity in the kitchen.

Jesse: Alright thanks bros. That was a real encouraging interview. Definitely.

The Woodpecker and the Apple Tree-a childlike story

I saw the woodpecker pecking the apple tree, tossing off the coat of moss off the bark with each thrust and flick of its head. I think I heard him say, ‘Hey are there any bugs in here to eat?’ And the apple tree said, ‘No, I’m just an old apple tree and even though the sun is out I’m still cold so please don’t take anymore of my coat off.’ ‘Oh dear goodness, I am sorry,’ said the woodpecker, ‘I didn’t know you were an apple tree. I’m new to these parts.’ The old apple tree was wise and kind and wanted to give help to the woodpecker who was hungry and in a foreign territory. So what did the apple tree do you might wonder since he was wise and kind? The apple tree told the woodpecker where to find the juiciest bugs in Portland, and not only that, the apple tree invited the woodpecker to come back in the late summer/early fall when his apples will be rotting and come partake in the apple maggots. ‘Why thank you Mr. Apple Tree,’ the woodpecker said, ‘You’re the wisest and kindest apple tree I’ve ever met.’ ‘Good day,’ said the apple tree, and there was peace in the land for that moment of time.

Poet, Theologian,& Contemplative (wanna be)

Is the silence as deep as eternity? Why do the voices never stop chatting non-sense? Learn to still those outbursts and let them not be hindrances but catalysts to the depths. Constant focus on the invitation and the one who sent it.

Time ticks.

Let time be an ally in proving the love to be true. Behold his elegant manner. Glimpses of glory. Food. Chew. Digest. Sweetness lingers on the taste buds. It costs to go deep, maybe even my sanity. Write about the experience in the language of imagination. emajyn full potential realized. I need to do this, I need to do that.

I need to slow down and love and be loved.

Cook up words that are shovels to dig deep under the walls that keep us apart. A new us. Image bearers. Lets live together and sing the song of ultimate reality. When am I going to really start living? Live out my beliefs, my conversation. My name is Jesse you can call me JG. I like my name. Its time to wrestle.

Qwel- Change is like first cousins with suffering. Change is the painful thing that we all… see we are conscious of growing, the tree isn’t conscious of growing, but the side effect of being conscious of growing is pain. Man you want your muscles to grow bigger you have to pop your muscles so they grow back bigger, you want your hair to grow thicker you have to shave, kill it and it grows. That is one of things that we’ve neglected with all our science is like pain is the physical sensation of change to some extent. Because our free will makes us so intelligent we’ve made ourselves unwise. No serious there are two different intelligences. There’s reading books, but wisdom is like if you touch a burnt cigarette you won’t do that again. You don’t have to remember it and show it off to your fucking F. Scott Fitzgerald friends. You know it forever, youknowwhatImsayin. But we know F. Scott Fitzgerald and we know so many of these other details that we the lose the big scheme of things a lot and shit. I dunno man… we just neglected that sensation I think.

emajyn- I think its on your track asceticism, you talk about at the end when your done rhyming one thing that will be a conduit of change is this thing that we live forever.

Qwel- we really, really  do live forever dawg. Man I don’t know, I just see it. Even physics the first law of fucking thermodynamics, and that’s like everything is thermodynamics and shit like Einstein and all these motherfuckers. But the first law of thermodynamics says that energy is neither created nor destroyed. Okay I agree with you. It just exists. When Moses said to God ‘what should I tell people to call you.’  Call me ‘I am’. The I am that I am. I exist. That sensation, that realization. The only way you can really appreciate and understand that situation is when you realize I am. Okay you learn what am I. Where am I?When am I? How am I? And then ultimately when you start talking to Him, its like why am I? He holds the answers to all the whys. Where a bird flys, how it flys, when it flys, what is a bird, why does it fly? nobody knows…I gotta go watch this booth man, serious man.

emajyn-all right cool man, thanks a lot Qwel.

 (a hip hop head who was listening in on the conversation who I started talking to after Qwel went back inside to sell product)- I’ll tell you right now Qwel is the greatest mc in the world right now. Bar none. Involve every element of hip hop, it doesn’t matter, Qwel is the greatest in the world. I’m not trying to convince you, its just a fact. And there is nothing anyone can do about for probably another couple of years. We’ll see how long he lasts. But right now he is the best.

emajyn- yea he keeps putting out those albums. Well you heard it straight from… whats your name man…

hip hop head- Luciano,

emajyn-Luciano? 

Luciano-Luciano (with an Italian accent) whats your name?

emajyn- Jesse

Luciano- hell yeah

emajyn- cool man, thanks, peace.

 So that concludes the inner view with Qwel. I had planned to ask at least one more question, like what he wanted on his epitaph, what he wants to be known for, what legacy he wants to leave on this earth, but oh well. I was blessed to say the least to get the conversation that I did. I think I agree with Luciano to, Qwel is one of the best mcs, but his music is the type of music that grows on you. Ask my homie Ms.haps who introduced me to Qwel and he’ll tell you I wasn’t feeling him at first. But his stuff just grew on me. I’m learning more and more that crazy good things can happen when we slow down our busy lives and take time to listen. peace.

(Before you dip into this interview please know that Qwel uses raw language. Its funny how when you type a tape recorded conversation you lose an aspect of communication that took place. You can’t sense my nervous energy or Qwel’s sincerity in what he says. I tried to type it like I heard it to capture the inner views of Qwel. Enjoy.)

emajyn- Its October 6th 2007 we are here with Qwel in Portland at Berbati’s Pan we got a hip hop show going on; we got hip hop rappers, djs, hype men, we got second hand weed smoke and alcohol flowing. I want to ask you this Qwel, say there is an aborigine from outside of civilization and comes into Western civilization and he starts hearing these beats, rhymes whether he goes to a show or hears a record, how would you describe to him what hip hop is? What is hip hop?

Qwel-Well I would just show him. If he comes in and its already playing, let him listen man. I guess its so cliche and shit but its like hip hop is a big umbrella. I would say he would have to pick and choose his own shit of what he likes from it, there is so much range in and out. Hip hop is culmination of all the music to date thus far until now. There is bluegrass drums, fucking Isaac Hayes drums, banjos and accordions. But I bet you the shit that I find raw he would probably find raw, the raw shit. Its something undeniable that maintains its primitive aborigine love to it.

emajyn- Yea, so from a lot of us are exposed to hip hop from the outside in, we see stuff like Kanye vs. 50 cent hype. How would you describe hip hop from being on the inside?

Qwel- there is two different things; there is hip hop the musicians and hip hop the business. Its like the difference between boxers and professional wrestlers. You don’t hold professional wrestlers to the same standard. You’re not like ‘macho man can’t fight.’ Its not about that shit. Its not what you come expecting, its a whole different thing. From the inside out, I’m inside one half of it that isn’t professional wrestling yet, but shit its quickly becoming underground professional wrestling. For me personally the difference in being an insider is you become a little bit more jaded when you meet some of these rappers, ‘no brown eminem’s back stage’ type motherfuckers. That’s kind of disheartening. But on a different level I get mad and frustrated at the way shit is cause I volunteered, I didn’t know I volunteered, but I volunteered not be a fan no more, knowhatImsayin. The only way I can stomach my own shit is like two bottles of red wine. Seriously you get this depression you don’t even like this shit. You like what you do but its part of the built in drive, okay you did that it was wack now move on or whatever. I’m  thankful for it and shit, I ain’t complaining, but even listening to other mcs and I’m like this is how I would have done that beat or I can’t just shut the fuck up and listen to this shit, it makes me mad. Cause like I dunno I miss it real bad. I can’t wait to just be Clark Kent instead of Clark Kent superman and shit. You know, just like be a fan and shit. Its weird cause if I had the freedom now to pick and choose what is good and not, I would definitely not be looking around to other fans to see what I should think is good. Its really weird man. I dunno we could talk forever about that. But that’s the only difference I know of, because accordingly I only know my shit and he only knows his shit.

emajyn- You seem to have a unique voice in hip hop  you’re bringing some deep spiritual content along with being really raw on the same tip. How would you describe that path you walk?

Qwel-Man, just same shit as you day to day.  Man I have kids and I have a wife dawg. When I had my first child. you remember the first time you did acid and you trip and its like clouds and fluffy crying half laughing tears. But the first three days after that when its the come down of like man that’s a tree for the first time for real. And we really live on a big brown and green thing, but big blue and white fluffy things floating over us like that’s it. That is really the real truth. All the science…Man the deepest physics, aerodynamic physics, says its impossible for a bumble bee to fly. Like mathematically the shape, the aerodynamics, the ratio between lift and drag, you know what I mean, they don’t add up in the proportions of a bumble bee. So the deepest science is still fucking Plato’s cave, motherfuckers standing in a cave talking about the shadows on the wall. We’re making those shadows, no wonder we agree.Yea, so having a kid it just kind of brought me back like I dunno I really don’t care about what anybody thinks. And the spiritual path man, I’m probably no more spiritual than every man ,but I look into these things that I feel, and these things that I see. Like love is a real thing you can’t measure it. Or all these other things they’re real and shit. I just looked into them,  I dunno probably same as you.

emajyn- Speaking about love, that track on The Harvest, ‘where I go, there I go’…

Qwel- I was so broke man. When I got married man..  I woke up in the morning, me and my wife were chillin, we weren’t even married yet and I was like ‘lets get married.’ I met her like three months before that, first time I met her. And I was like ‘let’s go get married right now.’  I borrowed the dough from her parents to get the marriage license, so broke but we went and got married. But when we got married we got our little spot together and  I don’t do anything beside rhyme and obviously its not paying well at this point and that is like my wedding present to her. Man I said, ‘ light forms through ballerina fingers and she sings when its funny, like honey harp strings strum to the breeze that just loves me. Like how when you dip your finger in honey how it makes like a string if you could do that so gentle to make honey harp strings or see a ballerina on stage the light through her delicate toe..’ man fuck Shakespeare. No doubt, plus not only that it was monumental to me because hip hop in the way it has been, has this consensus developed that hip hop doesn’t make really good love songs, it doesn’t make really good theme songs yet, it doesn’t make really good rock songs yet. And I feel like I made one of the most sincere straight up love songs.

emajyn-yea totally I printed out those lyrics and its just poetry, its just beautiful…. The albums of yours that I’ve really listened to a lot, one of my friends I worked with introduced me to your stuff a year or so ago, is The Harvest and Freezerburner….

Qwel- Well those are two parts of the same thing, I’m doing four seasons, so The Harvest is the autumn the harvest time and Freezer Burner is the winter album, I’m working on the spring right now…

emajyn- so with the season concept the motif seems to be this thing of change. Like what is change? The seasons change, you talk a lot about change…

Qwel- Change is like first cousins with suffering…

to be continued, stay tuned for part II.

• I’m going to connect significantly to the person I interview
• Expose people to people who otherwise wouldn’t meet
• Hearts can be expressed in beneficial ways
• An overall theme of reconciliation will take place
• I’ll learn to ask better question, because I’ve come to find that the question guides the quest.

We’ll see what happens…